38 responses

  1. Omega
    August 27, 2012

    On Shek’zeer fight, tanks taunted every 36 seconds.

    Lets look at prot warrior with 120 rage glyph who’s pooled 120 rage for his taunt. at very least with that 120 rage you have a pool of 12 seconds worth of shield block, you still need to make up 24 more seconds, or 4 more shield blocks.

    You taunt, hit shield block dropping to 90 rage, then immediately hit shield slam to regenerate 15 rage back to 105. then revenge, then shield slam or procs or whatever. point being. I pulled this boss 30+ times. ANY pull i did not miss a single revenge or shield slam, based on the pooling of 120, and the factoring of taunt trading, i could keep shield block up the ENTIRETY of the 36 seconds tanked, which was key because she melees like a frigging truck. During ANY pull where shield slam missed, i’d have insufficient rage generation to maintain that 100% up time and take a really hard hit to face that caught healers off big time. Revenge misses if only 1 i could MAYBE counter but shield slam was a bust almost every time unless lucky as hell with procs.

    This fight, and other fights in general, where taunts come every 30-40 seconds, coupled with the advantage of non tank time rage pooling, showed me it is possible to calculate and plan for 100% up time on shield block if all your hits connect every time. This to me placed hit/expertise at the highest stat value above all else. Now granted, you hit a boss like lei shi and block is completely useless and irrelevant then, but generally speaking, melee damage was significant. Also bear in mind that in 25 man raids, bosses melee TWICE as hard as 10 man, making block just that much more meaningful to 25 man raider then 10 man. On 10 man, you probably could get away with the hit/expertise irrelevant scheme, but on 25 man, I fully believe it is a non option and key to active mitigation up time to do hit/exp> all

    In a situation where you tank 100% of time on a target the scenario may also shift as well since you will lose that buffer that lets you start every taunt with a 12 second lead of rage generation time, so on certain fights other stat priorities may also be stronger as well, but i do believe the majority of encounters are just tank swapping majority of the time. Since warriors have pretty pitiful magic cd (cause lets phase it, barrier was nerfed too hard). I also believe stam is way to go as second stat. If we are doing perfect on our block up time and tank swaps, then we should mitigate melee good enough that our next stat just needs to mitigate everything else (the big nasty breaths, sprays, etc)

    • Omega
      August 27, 2012

      bah, 60 rage after first block, not 90, but you know what i mean, i had other numbers right (2 blocks with pooled rage).

    • Omega
      April 5, 2013

      Just updating some comment that 15% exp is pretty much the default now for progression raiding. With shield barrier having no cd at all it’s a strong canidate for spaming as a rage dump. the more rage the more mitigation

      also, a very important point to note, if you have 2pc tier 15, you SHOULD be using glyph of victory rush. the procs from the set bonus do count as killing blows and as such it makes the set bonus even more powerful (procs being worth 30% heals instead of 20%)

  2. Zellviren
    September 24, 2012

    Nice work, Hugh/Rebecca, a solid start for any tanking warrior. :)

    Couple of links for you, though:



    Those are the better two guides to use that I’ve found, and I’d avoid using Matt Rossi as a tanking resource; a lot of his information is questionable and, in some cases, downright bad.

    I’d also change the talent recommendations to Double-Time, Second Wind and Shockwave.

  3. andy
    September 30, 2012

    I have found the comments here almost as helpful as the actual guide. thanks to all who have commented and also to hugh for writing the guide. great job on them all.

    • Hugh Hancock
      October 1, 2012

      I agree – we have some ace commenters here, and I’d like to thank them all!

  4. Chase
    October 3, 2012

    I for the life of my can’t figure out why someone would choose Dragon Roar over Shockwave. Shockwave does decent aoe damage and stuns your targers for 4 seconds. That 4 seconds can often be a life saver by giving your healer time to heal you, giving you time to finish one off and use impending victory (if you are soloing a group) and has a cooldown of only 20 seconds opposed to the 60 second cooldown of Dragon Roar. Though Dragon Roar does more initial damage and would be the only consideration for choosing it, Shockwave can be used 3 times in the same span of time and ultimately tends to do more overall damage then Dragon Roar. Though true bosses can not be stunned, raids wipe just as often on large pulls of trash that can be stunned and the need for aoe tanking is just as relevant in 5.0 as it ever was.

    please, if you see something i didn’t, let me know.

    • Hugh Hancock
      October 3, 2012

      My experience is that most raid wipes occur on raid bosses, not trash, hence the suggestion of Dragon Roar. Last time I checked, DR also simmed higher DPS than Shockwave.

      However, I’d agree that this one is a very, very situational choice – once you’re familiar with the talent system, or if you’re in a role which involves dealing with significant amounts of stunnable mobs, Shockwave is an obviously better choice. Pick whichever one fits your role! (And look impressed at Blizzard actually managing to create a truly situation-dependent talent system!)

      • michael
        January 2, 2013

        its not just the dps from dragon roar its the fact if you use all 3 of those shock waves during a boss fight over a dragon roar that’s 3 globals that would have been used for devastate and a possible reset on shield slam where dragon roar is just 1 old comment though so I’m sure you already know this

  5. Dane
    October 21, 2012

    How are we dumping rage? Heroic strike on single target and cleave for AoE tanking?

    • Hugh Hancock
      October 22, 2012

      Yep, that’s correct. Thanks for mentioning that – wasn’t clear enough in the guide, so I’m rewriting.

  6. Jason
    December 7, 2012

    PSST: You left out ‘the pull’ section unlike your other tank guides, and got all excited about League of Legends instead ;)

  7. chorne
    March 7, 2013

    Why gem for strength?…

    • Hugh Hancock
      March 13, 2013

      Because I hadn’t updated that section :) Whoops. Updated now.

  8. hazy
    April 5, 2013

    15% expertise O_O where do these numbers come from, got 9% exp and ~7% hit and find it as solid as always

    to get to 15% expertise you should probably gem into expertise, reforge everything into expertise and use expertise potion :/ any idea?

    • Zellviren
      July 31, 2013

      Gemming into expertise is fine, assuming you’re using the Guardian’s Imperial Amethyst. The socket bonuses are invariably worth it, and the only other choice is parry… But avoidance sucks until 5.4, so it might be worth seeing where itemization takes you come the patch.

  9. Vicariois Prot Warrior
    May 3, 2013

    In my personal experience, shield barrier mitigates more damage over all with high amounts of vengeance and if it is hit every time there is enough rage available to do it(20 rage+). Also to the dragon roar v shockwave debate, I personally prefer dragon roar because of the simple facts that it is only 1 GCD, it, tied together with bloodbath on an aoe pull makes a prot warriors aoe agro reign supreme, and it’s more damage on a boss that shockwaves just won’t do.

  10. Machinelf
    July 10, 2013

    Deadly Calm was removed in MoP

    • Hugh Hancock
      July 15, 2013

      Thanks! I have done so.

  11. Zellviren
    July 31, 2013

    This guide is looking a bit dated now, Hugh; if you’re holding out for the launch of 5.4, I’d happily draft it for you to save you some time. :)

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