You’ve Got Less Power To Kick From LFD Groups. Discuss.

by on February 18, 2011


Polish your boot ‘cos it looks like you’re not going to be doing much else with it in random dungeon finder groups anymore. Blizzard announced some changes to the LFD kick facility the other day – Cryptic over at Blessing of the Grove has picked up on it and is taking a closer look.

I imagine Cryptic scratching his head as he wrote this post. It reads like he’s thinking out loud, trying to understand the changes. There are several changes to who can kick, when, and what the penalties for kicking someone will be, and in each case Cryptic’s going through and talking about whether he thinks it’s a good change.

Most of the changes are directed at guild groups and seemed designed to make it more difficult for them to remove another player who is placed with them in the dungeon finder. I have a problem with most of these changes mainly because Blizzard is trying to ‘fix’ player behavior by addressing the people around those players rather than addressing the problem directly. It feels like they are punishing players for queuing with others who have the same goals.

I agree with both his overall conclusion and quite a few of his assessments on individual changes. He illustrates the problems with the new rule about people who group with tank or healers being kicked from a group along with them particularly well. Personally I only kick randoms from a guild group if they’re acting like a right nitwibbler. Like Cryptic I’m feeling slightly persecuted for daring to run with a group of friends and, as Cryptic ponders, wondering what the extra penalties Blizzard have mentioned will be.

What do you think – are these dungeon finder tweaks counter-intuitive to the guild system or are they good protective measures that needed adding to the LFD tool?

Quote taken directly from Cryptic’s post
You can find Cryptic’s Blessing of the Grove homepage here

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{ 12 comments… read them below or add one }

Lujanera February 18, 2011 at 9:03 pm

It is now more difficult for pre-formed groups of 3 or 4 to kick the non-preformed members of the group.  I suspect this was intended to solve issues of abuse, but I don’t think things will actually work out that way.  The underlying issue — that the preformed group does not want somebody in their group — remains unresolved.  So players will resort to alternative ways of getting somebody out of the group:

Stop healing the pug member.  I suspect most people will lose patience after five deaths and drop group.
Misdirect mobs onto the pug.
Verbally abuse the pug member.
Go afk and wait for the pug to drop group.

These are all nearly as effective as kicking, but have the disadvantage of wasting everybody’s time to do the same thing.  My preformed groups often include a hunter, so I fully intend to use the second method if my kick button stops working.

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Stubborn February 18, 2011 at 11:24 pm

This will make me a better person, I think.  Not a happier one.  Not one who enjoys WoW more.  A better person, though better at what I’m not sure.
Excellent post that brings attention to an excellent subject.  Thanks!

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Cryptic February 19, 2011 at 12:18 am

There was some head scratching, some cursing. I think my wife summed it up best when she said “Blizzard made things like CC and interrupts vital to the success of a run, so why are they acting so surprised that people get kicked for refusing or not being able to CC?”

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Hugh Hancock February 19, 2011 at 2:05 pm

Yeah, unfortunately one of the things this change is going to promote is lively discussion as to how best to “remove” unwelcome PUGgers if your kick button isn’t working. I know I’ll be in that discussion too – I’m not prepared to do what Blizzard seems to want and tolerate all but the most spectacular extremes. I play this game for fun.

I’d much rather have a reasonably civilised way to do it, though.

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PVE Rogues February 19, 2011 at 2:21 pm

I don’t quite understand how the vote kick system works at the moment anyway. I rarely kick anyone and yet when I do need to kick someone because they are being a complete asshole, not doing thier job, needing on everything etc etc i have a kick cool down of something like 45 minutes.. how the hell? I just never do it at the end of the day because my cool down is so big anyway there’s no point trying. Most people wont leave of thier own accord either when acting like a jerk but you can’t kick them for like 15 minutes of the instance and for the last 15 minutes people dont want to have to wait for a new person to continue anyway.
 
It seems to me most of the time the vote to kick system works in favour of the people being a nuisance/ninja etc etc and against the others who are trying to have a nice friendly and smooth dungeon run because now we cant do anything about it if someones misbehaving except to leave ourselves and wait 15 minutes to queue up just to wait another 45 minutes to get a run.
I just dont get it :/

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PVE Rogues February 19, 2011 at 2:29 pm

Oh, just to add to lujaneras comment:
 
once i was on an alt tank doing gundrak recently. A hunter kept pulling all the mobs and being a general jerk but no one in our group could innitiate a vote to kick.Everyone in our group was from a different server. At the end, before the last boss we all got so fed up with him, we just sat down and refused to do the last boss. The hunter tried to solo him but failed miserably. He never gave up though. We waited 45 minutes to initiate a vote to kick while we sat down and had a chat about general wow stuff. then kicked him because we were so determined not to let him get away with it and get the run finished. We finally got rid of him, downed the boss and then stayed in our group to have a second run.
why? because im so sick and tired of people using the vote to kick system to thier advantage to be a jerk and misbehave in runs. we have to stop them getting away with it damnit :<
/angry rogue

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Hugh Hancock February 19, 2011 at 7:25 pm

I don’t know if you’ve seen the latest from Blizz – the maximum penalty for vote-kicking is now that you can’t initiate a vote-kick for TWO HOURS.

Yes, TWO HOURS. Or, to put it another way, ever.

I’m going to start a discussion about the best way to remove people from groups other than kicking…

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PVE Rogues February 20, 2011 at 9:23 am

2 hours? that’s crazy… instances only last for 30 minutes again now an hour tops with a bad group.
Why not just say, “there is no vote kick option” and be done with it.

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Imakulata February 22, 2011 at 11:47 am

PVE Rogues, I believe you get the penalty for clicking yes on votekicks initiated by someone else but the delay does not apply in that case. (As in: You might click yes no matter whether you have the penalty even if someone initiates a votekick a second after entering the dungeon.) I don’t know whether the penalty applies in case your kick failed.

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Hugh Hancock February 22, 2011 at 12:39 pm

Really? Ouch.

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PVE Rogues February 22, 2011 at 10:16 pm

well i tend not to vote yes for most kick either, but sometimes they still succeed from everyone else clicking yes, perhaps this is also causing mine to downgrade?

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Gustopher February 24, 2011 at 1:08 am

As a person who generally queues solo, I can see how a change of some sort is in order. Nothing worse than waiting 30 minutes to an hour to queue for a dungeon just to get kicked right after the 1st boss so a group of guildies can have their friend take my place…

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